PDA

View Full Version : How do you feel about this? (poor in America)


Mr. Cleanface
12-20-2007, 04:59 PM
New Orleans Housing Officials claim surplus: (http://www.nola.com/news/t-p/frontpage/index.ssf?/base/news-9/1198066889240600.xml&coll=1&thispage=2)

http://www.nola.com/hp/photos/121907_housing1.jpg

New Orleans resident Sharon Jasper, a former St. Bernard complex resident, was presented by activists Tuesday as a victim of changing public housing policies, took a moment before the start of the City Hall protest to complain about her subsidized private apartment, which she called a "slum." A HANO voucher covers her rent on a unit in an old Faubourg St. John home, but she said she faced several hundred dollars in deposit charges and now faces a steep utility bill.

"I'm tired of the slum landlords, and I'm tired of the slum houses," she said.

Jasper, who later allowed a photographer to tour the voucher-backed private apartment, also complained about missing window screens, a slow leak in a sink, a warped back door and a few other details of a residence that otherwise appeared to have been recently renovated. "I might be poor but I don't like to live poor. I thank God for a place to live but it's pitiful what people give you."

She looks really poor with that giant screen TV, couch, coffee table, house decorations of all sorts, etc.

So how poor is poor in the US?

The following are facts about persons defined as "poor" by the Census Bureau, taken from Dept. of Commerce, HUD, Dept. of Energy, more:

Forty-six percent of all poor households actually own their own homes. The average home owned by persons classified as poor by the Census Bureau is a three-bedroom house with one-and-a-half baths, a garage, and a porch or patio.
Seventy-six percent of poor households have air conditioning. By contrast, 30 years ago, only 36 percent of the entire U.S. population enjoyed air conditioning.
Only 6 percent of poor households are overcrowded. More than two-thirds have more than two rooms per person.
The average poor American has more living space than the average individual living in Paris, London, Vienna, Athens, and other cities throughout Europe. (These comparisons are to the average citizens in foreign countries, not to those classified as poor.)
Nearly three-quarters of poor households own a car; 30 percent own two or more cars.
Ninety-seven percent of poor households have a color television; over half own two or more color televisions.
Seventy-eight percent have a VCR or DVD player; 62 percent have cable or satellite TV reception.
Seventy-three percent own microwave ovens, more than half have a stereo, and a third have an automatic dishwasherOverall, the typical American defined as poor by the government has a car, air conditioning, a refrigerator, a stove, a clothes washer and dryer, and a microwave. He has two color televisions, cable or satellite TV reception, a VCR or DVD player, and a stereo. He is able to obtain medical care. His home is in good repair and is not overcrowded. By his own report, his family is not hungry and he had sufficient funds in the past year to meet his family's essential needs. While this individual's life is not opulent, it is equally far from the popular images of dire poverty conveyed by the press, liberal activists, and politicians.

.............

There are people dying of starvation across the globe who can't even get clean water to drink, medicine to heal them, or a protective roof over their heads, and we in America, like the woman pictured above, complain and make statements like, "I might be poor but I don't like to live poor. I thank God for a place to live but it's pitiful what people give you." Pathetic. They don't even have these things to give in other parts of the world.

I'm not saying there aren't people who need help in this country, but come on. Sack up Americans.

ragmop
12-20-2007, 10:42 PM
i hear you, joe. our "poverty" is wealthy relative to the rest of the world. but it's not a fair analysis. apples and oranges. it was reported this week that assets of just $2,200 places you in the top one-half of the world's wealthiest:

http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com/News/StudyRevealsOverwhelmingWealthGap.aspx)

crazy, i know. but i don't live in the amazon rainforest living off of what i grow in a grass shelter next to a clean water source. i DO live in a middle america in a mortgaged home that costs over $2,000 a year simply in utilities (excluding cable, thank you). any fair poverty analysis has to compare US poverty calculations in the context of the economic standard of living in this country.

i fully concede that many abuses exist within our welfare system (as they do in any system-- mortgage loan industry comes to mind recently), and safeguards have to be put in place to guard against abuses. but i do not believe for a nano second that this woman's story is representative of those in poverty in this country. but that is just me.

some resources for you to decide for yourself:

http://www.census.gov/hhes/www/poverty/trends.html

i ain't mad, joe. nor do i disagree with you. at all. *gasp!* i too believe in "pick thyself up". however, i also believe that as a society we have a moral obligation to tend to the weakest among us. and there are always creative people out there who will find a way to beat the system . . .

Mr. Cleanface
12-21-2007, 02:49 AM
Dang. Great response Ragmop. I'll leave now. :(

Seriously though, this story just made me think back to the 20's and 30's (watched Cinderella Man last night) when people in the US were truly poor, how it compares to this story, and the standards our 'poor' now enjoy. And speaking of the welfare system, the whole thing in New Orleans this story is associated with kind of bothers me.

Any thoughts on this NOLA deal?



It's a Christmas Miracle!!! A friendly Mr. C and Ragmop thread!!!


:D

ragmop
12-21-2007, 01:18 PM
It's a Christmas Miracle!!! A friendly Mr. C and Ragmop thread!!!

:D

L.M.F.A.O.

themysteries
12-21-2007, 04:10 PM
.

velvet hustle
12-21-2007, 04:31 PM
I've been to Nepal, India and Kenya and seen first hand what true poverty is. Anyone viewed Dark Days (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0235327/)? Those cats had it made compared to many in those 3 nations.

It is apples and oranges compared to here in the states though. Everything wrong with the lady in the articles place is wrong with mine and I don't have basic cable (by choice I must say). I guess I'm poor and living in inhumane conditions. The real problem with welfare isn't as much the system as it is people. It's a global issue as I've seen in Nepal, India and Kenya too but just different situations.

The problem is people becoming too dependent on support they have to do nothing to get. It's a free ticket and why should you want to get off if there is no deadline or time frame. They think "There's a roof over my head, I have water, electricity, food and can use a $100 food stamp for box of cereal and get $95 back in cash. Why do I want to leave this?" They don't want education, they don't want job training and why would they when they can sit at home and have the "basics" given to them. Then they have children who are raised in this mindset and the problem becomes generational not to mention the more kids they have the more support they get with no intent of making it on their own so the cost of welfare increases.

Now this isn't a blanket statement. I know in some cases welfare works. A single mom friend of mine was just on food stamps for a few months after she lost her job and was only working part time. Now she has a full time job again which pays enough that she does not qualify for food stamps. Welfare did it's job, it helped her when she needed it until she could move on. The problem is it seems most people do not want to move on.

Again, not a blanket statement but it's the same way in Nepal, India and Kenya only the support does not come from the gov. It comes from sponsorship. The mind set is if I can get sponsored I've got it made. "Sure I'm in a scrap metal 8x8 shack. Sure I have a dirt floor but I'm getting $20 a month from some organization and that covers food and some clothing, I don't have to work, I've got it made. Wait someone is going to pay for my kids to go to school? I don't have to work to pay for it? Sign me up. I'm willing to live in these conditions if I don't have to work and my "basic" needs are met."

Like I said I've seen it first hand. It's people content with complacency. I don't know what the solution is. Maybe an eligibility time frame limit? (but there will always be some tragic situations where that is no good) If someone is unemployed maybe require education and or job training for benefits (but that can be abused for years). Maybe the gov needs to impose a vasectomy plan for all males at birth (if that's possible). Once you turn 25 you must pass a competency/mind set test to have it reversed (on the governments bill and you get $2,000) if you want to have children. Maybe this would cleanse the gene pool and help a number of issues.

"make real and lasting change in the lives of children in need by empowering communities to lift themselves out of poverty"

This is what is needed but the people must want to be empowered and lift themsleves out rather than sit. That seems to be the overwhelming issue from my experiences.

BTW - the big V plan is a joke for those unable to detect it.

ragmop
02-18-2008, 05:03 PM
new studies on poverty's impact on early cognitive development. read here. (http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/021808E.shtml)

phrase that pays:

"Mainly, however, excuses for poverty involve the assertion that the United States is a land of opportunity, a place where people can start out poor, work hard and become rich.

But the fact of the matter is that Horatio Alger stories are rare, and stories of people trapped by their parents' poverty are all too common."

sway2sway
02-18-2008, 06:57 PM
As the article explained, neuroscientists have found that "many children growing up in very poor families with low social status experience unhealthy levels of stress hormones, which impair their neural development." The effect is to impair language development and memory - and hence the ability to escape poverty - for the rest of the child's life. So now we have another, even more compelling reason to be ashamed about America's record of failing to fight poverty.



that is interesting, huh?
it's almost like the stress is infectious- you can imagine that even before kids really know what's going down in their home, they can still feel the emotions that go along with it all.
gives new meaning to a viscious circle, not only psychological constraints, but actual physical changes to the brain.
I think social determinants of health was one of the subjects I found most interesting when I was in school- so many factors, so many implications- so much improvement can be made by an intervention which could be dismissed as unrelated.

the duke
02-19-2008, 10:43 PM
social determinants of health was a huge thing when I started my 2nd degree, and it's so important, yet people don't think much of it.

I'll admit, I get what they call youth allowance here. It's the govt's way of supporting myself while I'm at school, and then when I get a real job my tax money will foot the bill for the other students. I don't work a whole lot during the semester, and I do try and get by with my own cash rather than take hand outs, but at least if I can't work, I can still live. What pisses me off the most is the people who make more money than me in their part time jobs, get their employer to dodge the books up so they can get the full amount on top of what they're earning...that's not a fair system!

velvet hustle
02-20-2008, 04:47 PM
I'll admit, I get what they call youth allowance here. It's the govt's way of supporting myself while I'm at school, and then when I get a real job my tax money will foot the bill for the other students. ...What pisses me off the most is the people who make more money than me in their part time jobs, get their employer to dodge the books up so they can get the full amount on top of what they're earning...that's not a fair system!

It's not fair here either.

It's been a while back but I remember seeing ODB from the Wu Tang clan on an MTV segment go down in a limo to pick up his food stamps. Dude was part of a multi platinum selling group and still collecting from the gov.

Mad props to you though Duke. A "Use it don't abuse it" mindset would not only help those getting gov assistance but could offer tax relief as well.