Starbucks

[CaraD.]

I know, a little old news but just venting.
I love starbucks. I frequent a location 2-5 times a day.
I looked at the list the other day and figured that one or two would be closing in all of North Carolina since most people in NC get their coffee from McDonalds, local gas stations, from their own kitchen, or simply just drink sweet tea and not coffee. Well....
In all of Greensboro, Winston-salem, Kernersville, Statesville, Salisbury, Burlington, High Point and the rest of the piedmont/triad area in which I live in (the middle section of the state)...the ONE starbucks that they are closing in this (approx) 150 mile stretch along interstate 40, is the one that is right next door to my tanning salon, in which i mostly joined because of the convienance to that starbucks.

what are the odds.

[stricken]

Starbucks fan I am. Although only a couple of times per week. In Washington State, I will never be lacking for the fix, I'm sure. Addicted much? Maybe this will be a GOOD thing, Cara!

[CaraD.]

nah. this just means, i'll have to drive out of my way (ahem, polluting the air with my ride in order to DRIVE) to another starbucks.

[CaraD.]

its really a lose/lose situation for myself and the planet.

[tinkerlion]

wow, two to five times a day! that's a lot of caffeine:eek:!

[Nightlight]

I don't go to Starbucks very often (they don't have many here down under) but I'd LOVE to get one of those old Starbucks mugs with the big green logos on it. You know the ones? They don't make for general sale anymore. :(

[CaraD.]

do you want me to buy you one and ship it to you? i could send you two. its really not a big deal. let me know.

my affinity for starbucks didn't even occur until a year ago, when I went to San Francisco. I never even stepped into a starbucks prior to that trip. But one bathroom break in the starbucks in Giradeli (sp) Square and I was immediately hooked into the cozy funky atmosphere that starbucks had to offer. my favorite starbucks that i've been to in the past year is the starbucks on 5th and Arch in Philadelphia.
ok its 1:33am. I have a CPR class in the morning at 10. obviously my last coffee trip at 6pm is still having its effects and if i want to give my self enough time to go to starbucks in the morning, well then I better go to sleep.

seriously though nightlight- its not an issue. i'll totally send it to you.

[lietuvaite]

wow, two to five times a day! that's a lot of caffeine:eek:!

not only is that a lot of caffeine, that's a lot of $$, if you're drinking a cap or latte. if you go two to fives times a day, that's somewhere in the price range of $8 to $40 a day... $40 to $200 a week. you must be doing something other than delivering chinese food. damn, girl, how much money do you make, to be able to spend that much on coffee?!

[sweet pea]

At one point i was living off starbucks! I am nothing without my coffee! hahaha my tripple venti vanilla latte 8 pumps vanilla syrup no foam with whipped cream & whole milk makes me happy! but after going 2 to 4plus times a day (who needs food when u have coffee?) my dad sat down and did the math i was spending almost as much on my car payment a month! when i was in hawaii i was spending something outrageous for my coffee like $6-7 bucks a cup! i still have to have coffee and i still go to starbucks but i had to put a cap on it for sure...

[tinkerlion]

then there's also the issue of what caffeine does to you.

Caffeine is a diuretic, meaning it causes a person to urinate (pee) more. It's not clear whether this causes dehydration or not. To be safe, it's probably a good idea to stay away from too much caffeine in hot weather, during long workouts, or in other situations where you might sweat a lot.

Caffeine may also cause the body to lose calcium, and that can lead to bone loss over time. Drinking caffeine-containing soft drinks and coffee instead of milk can have an even greater impact on bone density and the risk of developing osteoporosis.

Caffeine can aggravate certain heart problems. It may also interact with some medications or supplements. If you are stressed or anxious, caffeine can make these feelings worse. Although caffeine is sometimes used to treat migraine headaches, it can make headaches worse for some people.

it seems like if you really want to get yourself in shape, up to the point of considering liposuction, then you have to be willing to change parts of your lifestyle. think of the amount of sugar and whatnot you could cut out of your diet that way!

[sauce.baby]

Not to mention that Starbucks [the company and their "coffee"] straight up sucks hairy infested ones.

[CaraD.]

My Venti iced skinny vanilla latte with 2 splenda costs $4.06 here.
Today I went to Starbucks 3 times. loves it.

[crunchy granola]

I feel like busting up a starbucks.

[angischy]

Ahhh...to be young, carefree, and of a disposable income! :p

My Venti iced skinny vanilla latte with 2 splenda costs $4.06 here.
Today I went to Starbucks 3 times. loves it.

You seem to take pride in that, despite others' critiques of spending so much $ on coffee, or your mindset, or Starbucks & caffeine itself...and that's certainly your right, but here's something you might wanna think about Cara . . .

* $4.06 x 3 = $12.18 (one day's worth of coffee & sugar consumption)

Let's say you do that so often that it averages thrice weekly ($12.18 x 3 = $36.54), all 52 weeks of the year ($36.54 x 52 = $1900.08! )

That's even more expensive of a habit than cigarettes (Assuming just 1/2 a pack a day habit @ $5/pack = $912.50/year)

Think how many concert tickets/trips/other useful/fun things that could buy...and how much more you'd have to show for them.
You could buy a hell of a nice coffee/cappuccino machine at home for way less the cost and not spend so much dough while on the go.

Three of those "skinny" coffees also account for almost 1/3 of your recommended daily calorie intake (160 calories (http://www.thedailyplate.com/nutrition-calories/food/starbucks/venti-skinny-vanilla-latte) x 4 = 640 non-essential calories). It might be good that you use Splenda instead of regular sugar, but then again, it's artificial and the side effects are debatable (http://www.womentowomen.com/nutritionandweightloss/splenda.aspx)...
For the teeth-staining factor alone, regular coffee drinkage is not-so-yummy after all, imo.

There are far worse habits to have, of course. ;) and despite the criticism some of us are putting out, your coffee kick might (perchance) be less than the bar tab/beer/pick-your-poison consumption costs of many of us here though :cool:

I'm just sayin...


(Funny this thread should come up on a day where I had a Nutrition class and spent half the day analyzing my own diet with an online calorie counter)

[crunchy granola]

Anybody? BUSTING UP A STARBUCKS.....

[angischy]

Anybody? BUSTING UP A STARBUCKS.....

What weapons of mass destruction will you be using?

I'm a big fan of a wrecking ball and monster trucks, myself. Oh, and steamrollers, they are essential!

[ragmop]

I say go for it, Cara. Drink it up. :)

[sway2sway]

A bit of a tangent, but I've been meaning to see this movie, Black Gold, now I see it can be watched on youtube, broken up into a number of parts.

the movie trailer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1DePOBjunXU

Multinational coffee companies now rule our shopping malls and supermarkets and dominate the industry worth over $80 billion, making coffee the most valuable trading commodity in the world after oil.

But while we continue to pay for our lattes and cappuccinos, the price paid to coffee farmers remains so low that many have been forced to abandon their coffee fields.


Nowhere is this paradox more evident than in Ethiopia, the birthplace of coffee. Tadesse Meskela is one man on a mission to save his 74,000 struggling coffee farmers from bankruptcy. As his farmers strive to harvest some of the highest quality coffee beans on the international market, Tadesse travels the world in an attempt to find buyers willing to pay a fair price.

Against the backdrop of Tadesse's journey to London and Seattle, the enormous power of the multinational players that dominate the world's coffee trade becomes apparent. New York commodity traders, the international coffee exchanges, and the double dealings of trade ministers at the World Trade Organisation reveal the many challenges Tadesse faces in his quest for a long term solution for his farmers.
http://www.blackgoldmovie.com/story.php


Personally, I try not to drink coffee out anymore. A while ago I switched over to fair trade coffee at home. It's pretty hard to get that at most places on the outside, here anyway. Also I've found, it's too easy to be using the disposable cups, I have a travel one, but maybe it's dirty under the seat of my car, or I forgot it at home or at the office. Plus the cost factor, as Ang said, we all 'waste' money on certain things, to each his own, but it's also 'to each his own' to be able to decide what we really don't need. Everyone is different, to me it's an excess that I try to live without, most of the time.
I think fair trade is an important consideration, not only for coffee, but for the myriad of commodities we basically steal from the third world and then big corporations get fat off of. The gap needs to shrink between poorAss farmer and fatAss cat. We need to think of the whole process as much as we can, when you purchase something, you are in essence voting YES with your $- not only to the product, but also the practices & processes that got it to you.

[lietuvaite]

i didn't mean to sound critical or judgemental, but was trying to point out that a lot of $$$ is being spent on cofee. but i can see that i may have come off that way; sorry. maybe a part of me just wishes i could spend money that carelessly again lol (i remember the days of having nothing in my fridge and a kick ass wardrobe. those days are gone mostly thanks to my husband lol)

[CaraD.]

yo yo yo!

If I am only spending $1900 a year on coffee than I am doing much better than I thought I was. I only went to starbucks twice today.
There are times when I haven't gone, and those times usually only occur when I am sick. However, the two recent trips I took to Philly in June I didn't go to starbucks at all.
wait, take that back. I went to a starbucks once on my second trip. My first guest of honor is for the most part anti coffee/anti fun/anti support my music/name dropper/one night stand stealer....but thats neither here nor there and we aren't really friends anymore.

and as far as the calorie in take goes, I don't really eat. I have fruits and veggies and an occasional pita slice with turkey. just not hungry these days.

[Miss Shark]

I've gotta say that their lattes are better than my local coffee shop, both here by the house and by the shop. I really don't care to spend the money, on what is a special treat for me, and have it taste bad. However, after reading sway's post I may just rethink even an occasional treat. I'll just keep grinding it up at home.

[sway2sway]

we all need treats, shark. you know it, I know it.

and I think you can actually request they press you a cup of fair trade coffee, but you'll have to wait longer and they'll probably make you pay more.
And it's not that they don't purchase fair trade coffee, I read, I think, that they purchase 10% of all coffee certified fair trade, which accounts for 6% of the coffee they purchase overall. They also give aid to coffee countries, build schools, clinics, that kind of stuff- but as was pointed out in the black gold info, they don't want aid, they want fair price for their coffee, sustainable independence.
Certainly starbucks is not all bad, but considering how much they are worth, and the image they project, I think they can do a lot better- they have the capacity.

This article was from last year, not sure what has transpired in the interim-

Starbucks, the world's largest coffee shop chain, and the Ethiopian government are on the verge of unveiling a deal that the company hopes will end attacks on the company's carefully constructed ethical image.

Starbucks spokesperson Bridget Baker said that "a licensing, distribution and marketing" agreement for three of Ethiopia's specialty coffees would be announced later this month.

If the company recognizes Ethiopia's decision to trademark the three coffees, it would represent a significant climb-down for the multinational corporation that claims to sell "Coffee that Cares."

An academic at the University of Oxford's Saïd Business School joined the attack with a stinging criticism of the company's stand, accusing it of hypocrisy and questioning its much-proclaimed social responsibility policies. Starbucks executives -- running an ambitious global expansion plan that aims to increase the number of the company's coffee houses from 13,700 in 39 countries to 40,000 globally -- were also aware that other companies, such as Green Mountain Coffee Roasters ("Fair Trade and Organic"), were cooperating with the Ethiopian initiative and winning praise for "exemplary" behavior.

What the Ethiopians have demanded is Starbucks' support for the country's innovative plan to trademark three of its coffees -- Harar, Sidamo and Yirgacheffe. Until now, the world's largest specialty coffee retailer has resisted the move, arguing instead for certification of bean names. Trademarking, say critics, would give power to growers; certification, they argue, is toothless.

The dispute sounds technical, but at root the controversy is about trying to close the gap between the $4 a Western consumer may pay for a cappuccino and the 50 cents a day earned by a laborer on an Ethiopian coffee farm (or on farms elsewhere in the world).
...
But as U.S.-based human rights organization Global Exchange points out, despite coffee's ranking as the world's most valuable traded commodity after oil (about 500 billion cups drunk a year), many small coffee farmers toil in "sweatshops in the fields", earning less than the costs of production, forced into a cycle of poverty and debt.

http://www.alternet.org/story/51936/?page=entire

[Miss Shark]

Same old story, different commodity.

[sway2sway]

true.

maybe you want to make that latte into a mocha, add on a decadent brownie. cocoa bean woes

The chocolate industry has failed to provide consumers with a reasonable assurance that the chocolate they buy was made without exploited and trafficked child labor. Major chocolate companies signed what is referred to as the Harkin-Engel Protocol in 2001, promising to eliminate the worst forms of child labor from their supply chains, after media stories emerged depicting the widespread use of forced child labor and trafficking on West African cocoa farms. After failing to meet their July 1, 2005 commitments, the Protocol was weakened and extended to July 1, 2008. Once again, the industry has missed the deadline.

Bama Athreya, Executive Director of the International Labor Rights Forum, said, “The major chocolate companies are not able to prove the elimination of exploited child labor in their cocoa supply, nor show concrete improvements in West African farmers’ lives. Consumers cannot be assured today that their favorite chocolate candies are made without abusive child labor.”

http://www.laborrights.org/stop-child-labor/cocoa-campaign/1556

maybe you want the new bannana-chocolate smoothie avec banana bread?
(I've heard they are starting to sell fair trade bananas, but I haven't seen them yet.)

The banana market is controlled by five large corporations - Chiquita (25%), Dole (25%), Del Monte (15%), Noboa (9%) and Fyffes (7%). Most bananas are grown on huge plantations, controlled by these corporate giants. The remaining banana production for export comes from small banana producers - family owned farms in places like the Windward Islands.

The competition between these banana corporations is fierce. These companies are extremely powerful both in exporting countries, and in their country of origin. Today, they set producer countries competing with each other, forcing governments to accept impositions with regards to taxes, tariff preferences, preferential access to loans, and deregulation of social and environmental policies.

These companies are integrated vertically up the chain. This means that they own or contract plantations, own sea transport and ripening facilities, and have their own distribution networks in consuming countries. It enables them considerable economies of scale, and they can sell 'dollar' bananas on the Northern markets at very low prices.

For example, the current legal minimum price paid to a producer for a box of bananas in Ecuador is $2.90. That same box can then sell in a British supermarket for about $25.00, with the supermarket taking more than a 40% share of the final price. Banana producers are constantly pressured to produce at even lower prices, pushing down wage levels and working conditions in plantations in an attempt to remain 'competitive'. Ecuador, the world's biggest banana exporting company, is leading the race to the bottom in the banana industry.

These corporations expatriate most of the profits from the producer countries:

Only 12% of the revenues remain in the producer country.
Plantation workers get only 7-10% of the revenues
Small farmers get only 1-2% of the revenues.

http://www.fairtradetoronto.com/products/banana.html#social

many more commodities and yes same old story, but we can change things through mindful consumption.

oxfam international site- fairTrade information
http://www.oxfam.org/en/campaigns/trade

[Miss Shark]

I'm off to the shop, but I will read all of the links later. Thank you very much for posting stuff like this. It needs to get out there, and you are right we can change things.

I wonder where my cocoa mulch comes from. Chocolate I can do with out, my great smelling mulch is quite another story.

[Miss Shark]

So I was thinking about this today on my way to the shop. It just doesn't get any worse than this as far as same old story different commodity.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/centralamericaandthecaribbean/guatemala/2461557/Guatemalan-mother-reunited-with-baby-stolen-and-sold-for-adoption-by-US-couple.html

[sway2sway]

that gave me chills midway through, shark.
double chills really.
first- just from the mom perspective, imagining it.
second- from the flukey/fateful 'grace of the universe' kinda way in which she found her. wow

good is, at least guatemala is trying to expose it.
worse is, this is likely the tip of a fatAss iceberg.

check this bit on vietnam-



Vietnamese babies are being kidnapped, bought and stolen from their parents then - in effect - sold for adoption in America, Britain and other Western countries, according to a new investigation.

In some cases hospitals have sent babies to orphanages for adoption after their parents were unable to pay medical bills.

In another, a grandmother sent a baby girl for adoption without informing her parents. The child was reunited with its mother following embassy enquiries.

The report by the US embassy in Hanoi states: “In five provinces, we discovered unlicensed, unregulated facilities that provide free room and board to pregnant women in return for their commitment to relinquish their children upon birth.”

Fraudulent documents then record that the baby was “deserted”. If the mother has a change of heart she must repay the facility for the accommodation she received.

More commonly, parents are persuaded by health officials or orphanage staff to place their children in orphanages in exchange for a typical payment of around £190. They are often told they can visit the child regularly or that it will be returned to them after a few years.

“In a terrifying number of cases the parents had no idea that they would never see their child again,” said Angela Aggeler, the embassy spokeswoman.

Forty-two American adoption agencies are licensed by the Vietnamese government. Many note on their websites that they make charitable donations to orphanages in the country or fund them outright. The average cost in official fees and travel expenses quoted to would-be adoptive parents is around £12,000.

According to the report, donations to the orphanages often amount to a kind of finder’s fee. One orphanage surveyed, “receives a fixed monthly donation for each child in the orphanage who is available for international adoption and the payment is made in cash directly to the orphanage director.

“This orphanage has seen the number of infants in its care increase by more than 2000 per cent in the past year, but it has not made significant increases in staff,” the report states.

Some adoption agencies flew the government officials who licensed them to the United States for shopping trips - and paid for their shopping.

Vietnam’s top adoption official, Vu Doc Long, called the report’s allegations “groundless” and rejected DNA testing or spot-checks on orphanages as an “unacceptable” way to reduce the problem.

http://ethnicallyincorrect.wordpress.com/2008/04/26/vietnamese-babies-stolen-for-adoption-in-west/



or Africa-


An estimated 500 African children a year - many of them babies - are being trafficked into the UK where they end up working as virtual slaves, a new investigation has revealed.

The children sold by their poor parents for up to $10,000 come mainly from West Africa, but there have been reports of children from other parts of the continent sold into the UK.


An undercover reporter working for the Daily Telegraph newspaper was offered several children for sale by their parents in Nigeria: Two boys aged three and five for $10,000, or $5,000 for one, and a 10-month-old baby for $4,000.

Teenage girls - including some still pregnant - were willing to sell their babies for less than $2,000.

The Telegraph report said that "impoverished African parents are being lured by the traffickers' promises of 'a better life' for their children, thousands of kilometres away in cities including London, Birmingham and Manchester. But, once brought to Britain, the children are used as a fraudulent means to obtain illicit housing and other welfare benefits, totalling tens of thousands of dollars each a year.

"From the age of seven, rather than being sent to school, they are exploited as domestic slaves, forced to work for up to 18 hours a day, cleaning, cooking and looking after other younger children, or put to work in restaurants and shops. Some of the children are also subjected to physical and sexual abuse, while others even find themselves accused of being witches and become victims of exorcism rites in 'traditional' African churches in Britain."

http://allafrica.com/stories/200802111563.html


and bulgaria


Police posing as doctors and nurses have arrested six people on charges of belonging to a Bulgarian gang selling babies "like puppies'', primarily to childless couples but also possibly to paedophiles living in Italy and France.


Police posing as doctors and nurses have arrested six people on charges of belonging to a Bulgarian gang selling babies "like puppies'', primarily to childless couples but also possibly to paedophiles living in Italy and France.

Officers in the northern Italian city of Trieste stumbled on the trade in newborn babies by accident through a routine phone-tap on a suspected Bulgarian mafia gangster, Stefano "Stevo'' Braidich, 44. Investigation revealed that "countless'' babies have been sold to western European countries, with infertile Italian couples paying €4,000 (£2,640) for a girl and up to €17,000 for a boy.

But officers say the arrests of three Bulgarians and three Italians last month may have touched only a small part of baby-trafficking from Bulgaria. Some infants, they say, may have been purchased for sale to paedophiles or for organ transplants. "Newborn babies were bought and sold like puppies,'' one policeman told La Stampa newspaper.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/bulgarian-gang-sold-babies-like-puppies-551111.html

That's enough countries and babies, huh?
Too bad there are many more.
It's sorta like cutting out the middleman from birth- instead of screwing the person over their entire life, not giving them a fair price for that which we make mass cash- we just screw them from the start.
Of course, from here, it's only a hop over to organs as commodities, but I'm not in the mood to languish with visions of severed kidneys&livers&lungs&hearts this morn', so I'll STOP.

[Miss Shark]

“This orphanage has seen the number of infants in its care increase by more than 2000 per cent in the past year, but it has not made significant increases in staff,” the report states.

I can't even comprehend how a child would be affected, being taken from their mother at gun point to wind up in a place like the orphanage above. Or worse still, how someone could do that to a family, to an innocent baby. It's supremely fucked up. Seriously what kind of life to you have to live to become so heart/soulless?

[sway2sway]

It's supremely fucked up. Seriously what kind of life to you have to live to become so heart/soulless?

I was mulling the same myself yesterday, except it was after hearing reports of war. I kept tossing it around, thinking of those who hatch these plans to kill & anguish other humans, millions of em', for power & money. I circled around this a bunch of ways, but really still can't understand or fathom.

It's like the opposite of wondering about angels dancing on the head of a pin.

[lietuvaite]

what a hypocrite i am... i was quick to be critical of the $ you spend on starbucks, cara, and now i'm addicted to redbull. i need to quit soon (but not today; i can quit whenever i want to, really). i even like to have two a day sometimes

i guess it's true about self-medicating and ADD

[hencoop]

I only tried Red Bull one night at a Christmas party, a friend of my husbands made me a red-bull/vodka and oh lordy lordy...